Possible birth in Russia

[Albatross365]

Hi,

I'm trying to track down a birth record for a John Charles Dickenson Smithies.

His birthplace on the 1891 census says Blackburn but I can't find a birth record for him. It says abt. 1859 and he was about 91 when he died in 1951

There is a possibility that he was born in Russia as his parents were involved in the textile industry and there is a Russian christening cup in the family.

Can anyone offer any advice on how to proceed or is this really a dead end?

[linell]

You could try an IGI search, or the National Archives, if his family were exporters there should be some documentation somewhere? HTH from Linell.

[Jimmy]

1901 also puts his birth place as Blackburn.
1901, Chipping, Lancashire.
Charles Smithies 42.
Betsy Smithies 36.
Margaret Smithies 17.
John Smithies 10.

[Jimmy]

Same occupation as 1901.
1881. Chipping, Lancashire.
William Dewhurst 56. Spindle & Fly manufactor.
Martha Dewhurst 60.
Charles Smithies 22. Adopted Son. Spindle & Fly Maker. born Blackburn.

[Jimmy]

1871. Chipping.
William Dowhurt 46. Spindle manufactor.
Martha Dowhurt 50.
Charles Smithies 12. Boarder.
Margaret Balshaw 27. Boarder.

[Jimmy]

???
1861.
John Dickinson 41.
Mary Dickinson 37.
John Charles Dickinson 3. Son. Born, Blackburn.

[Albatross365]

Thanks for all that.

I got it all from the census earlier.

Unless they added the Smithies surname I doubt that's a match.

I'll pop down the road to the National Archives sometime next week.

I tried IGI but found it very confusing to use. Came up with nothing.

Thought I'd managed to track his sister Maud down but unless there was another brother we don't know about it wasn't her.

[Maths girl]

???
1861.
John Dickinson 41.
Mary Dickinson 37.
John Charles Dickinson 3. Son. Born, Blackburn.

It might be interesting to see what this birth certificate states

John Charles Dickinson
Year of Registration: 1857
Quarter of Registration: Oct-Nov-Dec
District: Blackburn
County: Lancashire
Volume: 8e
Page: 275

Adding/ Changing surnames came naturally in those days especially in "adopting" situations and then reverting to some or all of original later in life.

[Maths girl]

???
1861.
John Dickinson 41.
Mary Dickinson 37.
John Charles Dickinson 3. Son. Born, Blackburn.

In full
1861 27, Nab Lane, Blackburn
DICKINSON, John Head Married M 41 1820 Joiner Brindle Lancashire
DICKINSON, Mary Wife Married F 57 1804 Blackburn Lancashire
DICKINSON, John Charles Son Unmarried M 3 1858 Blackburn Lancashire

[Albatross365]

Thanks for that.

Will check it out.

We know his parents died when he was young and that he was adopted by the Dewhursts and carried on their family business but didn't take their surname

It hadn't occurred to me that he might be adopted himself.

[Jimmy]

Thanks for all that.

I got it all from the census earlier.

Unless they added the Smithies surname I doubt that's a match.

I'll pop down the road to the National Archives sometime next week.

I tried IGI but found it very confusing to use. Came up with nothing.

Thought I'd managed to track his sister Maud down but unless there was another brother we don't know about it wasn't her.

What other details have you on his sister Maud.

[Albatross365]

That she never married.

That's it. Only found out she existed last night.

According to the 1871 census she was living as a boarder aged 10 in Grimsargh with a Frederick Smithies aged 9 who no-one knows about.

This would make sense if the parents died when the children were young.

[gardener]

FreeBMD has

Birth Jun qtr 1860 Blackburn 8e 342
Alice Maud Mary Smithies

and

Birth Dec qtr 1861 Blackburn 8e 300
Frederick Arthur Smithies

1891
Alston
Fred A Smithies head wid 29 gardener Blackburn
John ditto son 6 scholar Grimsargh
Mary ditto dau 4 Alston
Alice Maud Mary ditto sister s 30 dressmaker Blackburn
Alfred ditto brother s 26 farmer Blackburn

[Maths girl]

1891 Wolf House Mill
John Charles D Smithies 32 Spindle Fly Maker
Betsy Smithies 26
Margaret Smithies 7 Scholar
John Smithies 9/12

[Maths girl]

DOes this help or confuse?

John Charles Dickinson Smithies
Gender: Male
Birth Date: abt 1859
Age: 24
Father's Name: John Smithies
Spouse's name: Betsy Procter
Spouse's Age: 19
Spouse's Father's Name: John Procter
Marriage Date: 18 Jan 1883
Marriage Place: Blackburn, Lancashire, England

or this?
Charles Edward Smithies
Year of Registration: 1859
Quarter of Registration: Jul-Aug-Sep
District: Huddersfield
County: Yorkshire - West Riding, West Yorkshire
Volume: 9a
Page: 3_2