I have information from a contact on Ancestry that this Joseph Cole here:
http://bcconnections.tribalpages.com/tr ... 0&bpid=626
who married Ann/Hannah Tromans, is not the son of Benjamin Cole & Phoebe Smith, but rather, the son of Richard and Rebecca Cole (nee Garratt).
My informant says that Joseph & Ann/Hannah Cole are her 2x Greatgrandparents and that she has their marriage certificate and it names Richard as Joseph's father.
This seems pretty conclusive. Should I change on BCC? I have been offered copies of the birth and marriage certificates to substantiate this.
*Arc tbc* ---Joseph Cole abt 1837, Rowley Regis
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dianel
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*Arc tbc* ---Joseph Cole abt 1837, Rowley Regis
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Re: Joseph Cole abt 1837, Rowley Regis
Going to move this to the black country section Dianel.
Jo
Jo
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Re: Joseph Cole abt 1837, Rowley Regis
Oh, thanks, Jo. I meant it to go in there.
Extracted IGI entry:
REBECCA GARRATT
Spouse: RICHARD COLE
Marriage: 26 OCT 1835 Saint Thomas, Dudley, Worcester, England
1841
At New Street, Rowley Regis
Richard Cole 29 Coal Miner b. in county
Rebecca Cole 28 not b. in county
Joseph Cole 3 b. in county
Lucy Cole 6 weeks b. in county
1851
At Blackheath, Rowley Regis
Richard Cole Head 35 Cole Miner b. Rowley, Staffordshire
Rebeckah Cole Wife 39 b. Worster Shire
Joseph Cole Son 11 Cole Miner b. Rowley, Staffordshire
Ruth Cole Daur 9 b. Rowley, Staffordshire
William Cole Son 7 b. Rowley, Staffordshire
Julies Cole Son 3 b. Rowley, Staffordshire
1861
At Mincing Lane, Rowley Regis
Richard Cole Head 47 Coal Miner b. Worcs., Northfield
Rebecca Cole Wife 49 Nail Maker b. Worcs., Northfield
Ruth Cole Daur 19 Nail Maker b. Staffs., Rowley Regis
William Cole Son 17 Coal Miner b. Worcs., Netherton
Julias Cole Son 13 Coal Miner b. Worcs., Netherton
Samuel Cole Son 9 Scholar b. Staffs., Rowley Regis
Mary Cole Boarder 2 b. Staffs., Rowley Regis
England & Wales, FreeBMD Death Index:
Richard Cole
Estimated birth year: abt 1815
Year of Registration: 1869
Quarter of Registration: Apr-May-Jun
Age at Death: 54
District: Dudley (To 1912)
County: Staffordshire, Worcestershire
1871
At 1 Court, Sims Lane, Dudley, Netherton
Ruth Gordon Head Widow 29 Nailor b. Worcs., Netherton, Dudley
Frederick Gordon Son 7 Scholar b. Worcs., Netherton, Dudley
George Gordon Son 2 b. Worcs., Netherton, Dudley
Rebecca Coal Boarder Widow 54 Nailor b. Worcs., Netherton, Dudley
Samuel Coal Son 19 Coal Miner b. Worcs., Netherton, Dudley
Polly Coal Daur 11 Nailor b. Rowley Regis, Staffs.
Next door, at 2 Court, Sims Lane, Dudley, Netherton are:
Julius Garratt Head 35 Nailor b. Worcs., Netherton, Dudley
Sarah Garratt Wife 33 Nailor b. Worcs., Netherton, Dudley
William Garratt Son 5 Scholar b. Worcs., Netherton, Dudley
Shelah Garratt Son 2 mths. b. Worcs., Netherton, Dudley
Next door again, at 3 Court, Sims Lane, Dudley, Netherton are:
Julius Garratt Head 26 Labourer b. Worcs., Netherton, Dudley
Ann Garratt Wife 22 Nailor b. Worcs., Netherton, Dudley
Esther Garratt Daur 3 Scholar b. Worcs., Netherton, Dudley
Saml. Garratt Son 2 mths. b. Worcs., Netherton, Dudley
1881
At Croft, Dudley, Netherton
Rebacca Cole Head Widow 69 No Trade b. Worcs., Netherton
Ruth Cole Daur 41 Nail Maker b. Worcs., Netherton
Frederick Cole Son 16 Coql Miner b. Worcs., Netherton
George Cole Son 13 Unemployed b. Worcs., Netherton
Extracted IGI entry:
REBECCA GARRATT
Spouse: RICHARD COLE
Marriage: 26 OCT 1835 Saint Thomas, Dudley, Worcester, England
1841
At New Street, Rowley Regis
Richard Cole 29 Coal Miner b. in county
Rebecca Cole 28 not b. in county
Joseph Cole 3 b. in county
Lucy Cole 6 weeks b. in county
1851
At Blackheath, Rowley Regis
Richard Cole Head 35 Cole Miner b. Rowley, Staffordshire
Rebeckah Cole Wife 39 b. Worster Shire
Joseph Cole Son 11 Cole Miner b. Rowley, Staffordshire
Ruth Cole Daur 9 b. Rowley, Staffordshire
William Cole Son 7 b. Rowley, Staffordshire
Julies Cole Son 3 b. Rowley, Staffordshire
1861
At Mincing Lane, Rowley Regis
Richard Cole Head 47 Coal Miner b. Worcs., Northfield
Rebecca Cole Wife 49 Nail Maker b. Worcs., Northfield
Ruth Cole Daur 19 Nail Maker b. Staffs., Rowley Regis
William Cole Son 17 Coal Miner b. Worcs., Netherton
Julias Cole Son 13 Coal Miner b. Worcs., Netherton
Samuel Cole Son 9 Scholar b. Staffs., Rowley Regis
Mary Cole Boarder 2 b. Staffs., Rowley Regis
England & Wales, FreeBMD Death Index:
Richard Cole
Estimated birth year: abt 1815
Year of Registration: 1869
Quarter of Registration: Apr-May-Jun
Age at Death: 54
District: Dudley (To 1912)
County: Staffordshire, Worcestershire
1871
At 1 Court, Sims Lane, Dudley, Netherton
Ruth Gordon Head Widow 29 Nailor b. Worcs., Netherton, Dudley
Frederick Gordon Son 7 Scholar b. Worcs., Netherton, Dudley
George Gordon Son 2 b. Worcs., Netherton, Dudley
Rebecca Coal Boarder Widow 54 Nailor b. Worcs., Netherton, Dudley
Samuel Coal Son 19 Coal Miner b. Worcs., Netherton, Dudley
Polly Coal Daur 11 Nailor b. Rowley Regis, Staffs.
Next door, at 2 Court, Sims Lane, Dudley, Netherton are:
Julius Garratt Head 35 Nailor b. Worcs., Netherton, Dudley
Sarah Garratt Wife 33 Nailor b. Worcs., Netherton, Dudley
William Garratt Son 5 Scholar b. Worcs., Netherton, Dudley
Shelah Garratt Son 2 mths. b. Worcs., Netherton, Dudley
Next door again, at 3 Court, Sims Lane, Dudley, Netherton are:
Julius Garratt Head 26 Labourer b. Worcs., Netherton, Dudley
Ann Garratt Wife 22 Nailor b. Worcs., Netherton, Dudley
Esther Garratt Daur 3 Scholar b. Worcs., Netherton, Dudley
Saml. Garratt Son 2 mths. b. Worcs., Netherton, Dudley
1881
At Croft, Dudley, Netherton
Rebacca Cole Head Widow 69 No Trade b. Worcs., Netherton
Ruth Cole Daur 41 Nail Maker b. Worcs., Netherton
Frederick Cole Son 16 Coql Miner b. Worcs., Netherton
George Cole Son 13 Unemployed b. Worcs., Netherton
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Re: Joseph Cole abt 1837, Rowley Regis
this is joseph
1881 12 Oldbury Rd Blkheath Rowley Regis, Stafford
Joseph COLE 43 Rowley Regis, Stafford, Coal Miner
Hannah COLE 41 Rowley Regis, Stafford,
Samuel COLE 19 Rowley Regis, Stafford, Pipe Maker (Earthenware)
Rebecca COLE 16 Rowley Regis, Stafford, Nail Maker
Sarah Jane COLE 10 Rowley Regis, Stafford, Scholar
Phoebe COLE 5 Rowley Regis, Stafford, Scholar
Ann COLE 3 Rowley Regis, Stafford,
Hannah Eliza COLE 3 m Rowley Regis, Stafford,
Isaac BAKER Boarder 50 Rowley Regis, Stafford, Nail Maker
1871 Blackheath
Joseph Coles 32 Coal miner
Hannah Coles 29 Nail Maker
Richard Coles 11
Samuel Coles 9
Rebecca Coles 7
Sarah I Coles 2 months
All born RR
his first born called richard ?
1861Blackheath
Joseph Cole 24 Coalminer Netherton
Ann Cole 22 Nailmaker, Rowley regis
Richard Cole 1
1881 12 Oldbury Rd Blkheath Rowley Regis, Stafford
Joseph COLE 43 Rowley Regis, Stafford, Coal Miner
Hannah COLE 41 Rowley Regis, Stafford,
Samuel COLE 19 Rowley Regis, Stafford, Pipe Maker (Earthenware)
Rebecca COLE 16 Rowley Regis, Stafford, Nail Maker
Sarah Jane COLE 10 Rowley Regis, Stafford, Scholar
Phoebe COLE 5 Rowley Regis, Stafford, Scholar
Ann COLE 3 Rowley Regis, Stafford,
Hannah Eliza COLE 3 m Rowley Regis, Stafford,
Isaac BAKER Boarder 50 Rowley Regis, Stafford, Nail Maker
1871 Blackheath
Joseph Coles 32 Coal miner
Hannah Coles 29 Nail Maker
Richard Coles 11
Samuel Coles 9
Rebecca Coles 7
Sarah I Coles 2 months
All born RR
his first born called richard ?
1861Blackheath
Joseph Cole 24 Coalminer Netherton
Ann Cole 22 Nailmaker, Rowley regis
Richard Cole 1
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Re: Joseph Cole abt 1837, Rowley Regis
right here looks like a different joseph or a previous marriage ?
1871 MacMillans Green's
Joseph Cole 29 Nailmaker
Sarah Cole 24
William Cole 4
John Cole 2
all born RR
Note the next house on image is the start of mincing lane where joseph cole c 1837 parents was in 1861 ?
poss 1861 Oakham Cottages
Mary Cox 63
Eliza Randle 24
Joseph Cole 18 Rowley
1871 MacMillans Green's
Joseph Cole 29 Nailmaker
Sarah Cole 24
William Cole 4
John Cole 2
all born RR
Note the next house on image is the start of mincing lane where joseph cole c 1837 parents was in 1861 ?
poss 1861 Oakham Cottages
Mary Cox 63
Eliza Randle 24
Joseph Cole 18 Rowley
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Re: Joseph Cole abt 1837, Rowley Regis
submitted
JOSEPH COLE
Christening: 17 SEP 1837 Rowley Regis, Stafford,
Father: BENJAMIN COLE
Mother: PHEBE
submitted
JOSEPH COLE
Christening: 05 MAR 1837 St Thomas, Dudley, Worcester,
Father: WILLIAM COLE
Mother: SARAH
extracted
JOSEPH COLE
Christening: 09 SEP 1838 Halesowen, Worcester,
Father: TIMOTHY COLE
Mother: MARY
submitted
JOSEPH COLE
Birth: 22 AUG 1838
Christening: 17 NOV 1839 St Thomas, Dudley, Worcester,
Father: RICHARD COLE
Mother: REBECCA
JOSEPH COLE
Christening: 17 SEP 1837 Rowley Regis, Stafford,
Father: BENJAMIN COLE
Mother: PHEBE
submitted
JOSEPH COLE
Christening: 05 MAR 1837 St Thomas, Dudley, Worcester,
Father: WILLIAM COLE
Mother: SARAH
extracted
JOSEPH COLE
Christening: 09 SEP 1838 Halesowen, Worcester,
Father: TIMOTHY COLE
Mother: MARY
submitted
JOSEPH COLE
Birth: 22 AUG 1838
Christening: 17 NOV 1839 St Thomas, Dudley, Worcester,
Father: RICHARD COLE
Mother: REBECCA
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gardener
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Re: Joseph Cole abt 1837, Rowley Regis
That looks sound to me Di. If you could see the marriage cert it would be nice just to confirm it.
The Joseph Cole on BCC here http://bcconnections.tribalpages.com/tr ... =600772628
is the sone of Bejamin Cole and Phoebe (Smith) fits this baptism:
RR 17th Sep 1837 Joseph Cole son of Benjamin and Phebe Cole, Perry's Lake, nailer
1861 has (from griffs4bears) (edited, I said 1851 by mistake)
Perrys Lake
Benjamin Cole wid 58
Joseph Cole unm son 24
Benjamin Cole unm son 18
Helen Cole unm dau 14
Ann Hopkins m dau 21
Edward Hopkins m son in law 21
Judging by that the family group is right but Joseph did not marry Hannah Tromans.
Could someone chase up that 1861 census entry and see what Joseph Cole has as occupation, then try and find him in 1871?
Maybe NL would then give the go ahead for disconnecting Joseph * Hannah and replacing him with this one?
The Joseph Cole on BCC here http://bcconnections.tribalpages.com/tr ... =600772628
is the sone of Bejamin Cole and Phoebe (Smith) fits this baptism:
RR 17th Sep 1837 Joseph Cole son of Benjamin and Phebe Cole, Perry's Lake, nailer
1861 has (from griffs4bears) (edited, I said 1851 by mistake)
Perrys Lake
Benjamin Cole wid 58
Joseph Cole unm son 24
Benjamin Cole unm son 18
Helen Cole unm dau 14
Ann Hopkins m dau 21
Edward Hopkins m son in law 21
Judging by that the family group is right but Joseph did not marry Hannah Tromans.
Could someone chase up that 1861 census entry and see what Joseph Cole has as occupation, then try and find him in 1871?
Maybe NL would then give the go ahead for disconnecting Joseph * Hannah and replacing him with this one?
"The present is the key to the past" - Charles Lyell
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Re: Joseph Cole abt 1837, Rowley Regis
That is fine to disconnect Di and alter as you think fit.
It does look like Richard with the name of the child
but as Gardener says that marriage would be good to just confirm.
Maybe disconnect, sort and add marriage info later just as a dble check
does that sound ok and are you ok to sort it?
so who did the other one marry?
It does look like Richard with the name of the child
but as Gardener says that marriage would be good to just confirm.
Maybe disconnect, sort and add marriage info later just as a dble check
does that sound ok and are you ok to sort it?
so who did the other one marry?
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Re: Joseph Cole abt 1837, Rowley Regis
1851. Perrys Lake.
Benjn Cole 45. Nail forger.
Pheba Cole 44.
Fanney Cole 23.
Eliza Cole 18.
Josh Cole 13.
Benjn Cole 9.
Elin Cole 3.
William Cole 1.
Ann Cole 11. Visiter.
All born Rowley Regis.
Benjn Cole 45. Nail forger.
Pheba Cole 44.
Fanney Cole 23.
Eliza Cole 18.
Josh Cole 13.
Benjn Cole 9.
Elin Cole 3.
William Cole 1.
Ann Cole 11. Visiter.
All born Rowley Regis.
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Jimmy
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Re: Joseph Cole abt 1837, Rowley Regis
1861.
Benjamin Cole 54. Nailer.
Joseph Cole 24.
Benjamin Cole 18.
Hellen Cole 14.
Ann Hopkins 21.
Edward Hopkins 21.
Benjamin Cole 54. Nailer.
Joseph Cole 24.
Benjamin Cole 18.
Hellen Cole 14.
Ann Hopkins 21.
Edward Hopkins 21.
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Jimmy
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Re: Joseph Cole abt 1837, Rowley Regis
Submitted.
Benjamin Cole.
Birth, About 1807. Rowley Regis, Stafford.
Phebe Smith.
Marriage, 06 AUG 1827. Tipton, Stafford.
Benjamin Cole.
Birth, About 1807. Rowley Regis, Stafford.
Phebe Smith.
Marriage, 06 AUG 1827. Tipton, Stafford.
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Re: Joseph Cole abt 1837, Rowley Regis
gardener wrote:That looks sound to me Di. If you could see the marriage cert it would be nice just to confirm it.
The Joseph Cole on BCC here http://bcconnections.tribalpages.com/tr ... =600772628
is the sone of Bejamin Cole and Phoebe (Smith) fits this baptism:
RR 17th Sep 1837 Joseph Cole son of Benjamin and Phebe Cole, Perry's Lake, nailer
1861 has (from griffs4bears) (edited, I said 1851 by mistake)
Perrys Lake
Benjamin Cole wid 58
Joseph Cole unm son 24
Benjamin Cole unm son 18
Helen Cole unm dau 14
Ann Hopkins m dau 21
Edward Hopkins m son in law 21
Judging by that the family group is right but Joseph did not marry Hannah Tromans.
Could someone chase up that 1861 census entry and see what Joseph Cole has as occupation, then try and find him in 1871?
Do you still want this info Di?
Joseph is a nailer in 1861, born R/Regis
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Re: Joseph Cole abt 1837, Rowley Regis
A possible but age is out 
1871: Macmillans Green, Rowley Regis
Joseph Cole 29 Head M Nailmaker
Sarah Cole 24 Wife M Nailmaker
William Cole 4 Son
John Cole 2 Son
(all born R/Regis)
Marriage 1865
COLE Joseph SMITH Sarah Dudley, St Thomas 204/023/317
1871: Macmillans Green, Rowley Regis
Joseph Cole 29 Head M Nailmaker
Sarah Cole 24 Wife M Nailmaker
William Cole 4 Son
John Cole 2 Son
(all born R/Regis)
Marriage 1865
COLE Joseph SMITH Sarah Dudley, St Thomas 204/023/317
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Re: Joseph Cole abt 1837, Rowley Regis
Ancestry has two Joseph Coles born 1838 Worcestershire. One must be
1871 Blackheath
Joseph Coles 32 Coal miner
Hannah Coles 29 Nail Maker
Richard Coles 11
Samuel Coles 9
Rebecca Coles 7
Sarah I Coles 2 months
Who is the other? - Now I wish I hadn't decided to economise and cut back on subscriptions:-(
1871 Blackheath
Joseph Coles 32 Coal miner
Hannah Coles 29 Nail Maker
Richard Coles 11
Samuel Coles 9
Rebecca Coles 7
Sarah I Coles 2 months
Who is the other? - Now I wish I hadn't decided to economise and cut back on subscriptions:-(
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Re: Joseph Cole abt 1837, Rowley Regis
Extracted.
JOSEPH COLE.
SARAH COLEY.
Marriage, 18 JAN 1863. Clent, Worcester.
Submitted.
JOSEPH COLE.
Father: JOHN COLE.
SARAH TAYLOR.
Father: GEORGE.
Marriage: 29 AUG 1858. St Thomas, Dudley, Worcester.
Submitted.
JOSEPH COLE.
Father: JOHN COLE.
SARAH SMITH.
Father: JOHN.
Marriage: 24 JUL 1865. St Thomas, Dudley, Worcester.
Husband Age at Marriage, 22.
Wife Age at Marriage, 19.
JOSEPH COLE.
SARAH COLEY.
Marriage, 18 JAN 1863. Clent, Worcester.
Submitted.
JOSEPH COLE.
Father: JOHN COLE.
SARAH TAYLOR.
Father: GEORGE.
Marriage: 29 AUG 1858. St Thomas, Dudley, Worcester.
Submitted.
JOSEPH COLE.
Father: JOHN COLE.
SARAH SMITH.
Father: JOHN.
Marriage: 24 JUL 1865. St Thomas, Dudley, Worcester.
Husband Age at Marriage, 22.
Wife Age at Marriage, 19.
Last edited by Jimmy on Fri Nov 27, 2009 9:11 pm, edited 1 time in total.