UPDATE -Parkes family Rowley Regis problem

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apowell
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UPDATE -Parkes family Rowley Regis problem

Post by apowell »

Hi everyone,

I'm afraid it's me again with another topic that needs your expert advice on. I've found another relative from Rowley Regis James Batty who married Hannah Parkes born abt 1829 Wednesbury. This is when it really confuses me but I've managed to find out the following:

1841 census
John Parkes born 1801
Pheobe Parkes born 1791
Mariah Parkes born 1826
Sml Parkes born 1826
James Batty born 1834

1851 census
John Westwood born 1805 Rowley Regis (Head)
Hannah Westwood born 1811 Rowley Regis (Wife)
Richard Westwood born 1838 Rowley Regis (Son)
Thomas Westwood born 1843 Rowley Regis (Son)
James Batty born 1834 Dudley (Son of wife)

I checked on John Parkes family that James was living with on the 1841 census:

1851 census
John Parkes born 1801 Rowley Regis (Head)
Phebe Batty born 1791 Rowley Regis (Lodger)
Phebe Batty born 1834 Rowley Regis (Lodger)
Eli Batty born 1823 Rowley Regis (Son of lodger)
Mary Ann Batty 1841 Rowley Regis (Lodger)

Samuel Batty is married and living next door to the above.

Hannah Westwood was living with her husband John on the 1841 census.

Interestingly living 2 doors away to the Westwoods on the 1851 census are the Parkes family.

The last bit of information I got by chance was that Abel Parkes was living with John and Hannah Westwood on the 1861 census.

I've found lots of information on the Black Country connections regarding the Parkes family but have no idea how James and his mother all fit into the family but I'm sure they do somewhere.

Any ideas how to piece this jigsaw together and find out who's who.

Oh dear I'm in :shock:
Kind regards
Adrian

ps
Thomas Mole Thread update
I've ordered the birth certificate for Thomas Mole and Samuel Mole and Ann Bird's marriage certificate (will update you once I receive).
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FarSide
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Re: Parkes family Rowley Regis problem

Post by FarSide »

Trying to get my head around this, possibly Hannah and Phebe were sisters.

Extracted
JAMES BAYTY
Christening: 01 JUN 1834 Saint Thomas, Dudley
Parents:
Mother: HANNAH BAYTY


1841 census
John Parkes born 1801
Pheobe Parkes born 1791
Mariah Parkes born 1826
Sml Parkes born 1826
James Batty born 1834


1841
Waterfall Lane, Rowley
John Parkes 40 - Nailor
Phebe Parkes 50
Elizabeth Parkes 19
Mariah Parkes 15
Saml Parkes 15
Eli Parkes 14

living in the same house
James Braley 7
Phebe Braley 5
Mary Braley 3 Mo
all b in c

Poss marriage for Mary ann Batty (lookup?)
1859
BATTY Mary A BELLCHER William Cradley Heath, St Luke Sandwell Register Office 20/1/98
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Re: Parkes family Rowley Regis problem

Post by peterd »

JAMES BAYTY
Christening: 01 JUN 1834 Saint Thomas, Dudley, Worcester,

Mother: HANNAH BAYTY


she marries john


HANNAH BAITY
JOHN WESTWOOD
Marriage: 05 JUL 1835 Saint Thomas, Dudley, Worcester,



1851 census
John Westwood born 1805 Rowley Regis (Head)
Hannah Westwood born 1811 Rowley Regis (Wife)
Richard Westwood born 1838 Rowley Regis (Son)
Thomas Westwood born 1843 Rowley Regis (Son)
James Batty born 1834 Dudley (Son of wife)

marries hannah

JAMES BATEY
HANNAH PARKES
Marriage: 01 DEC 1851 Saint Thomas, Dudley, Worcester,


1881 Halesowen Rd 128 Rowley Regis, Stafford

James BATTY 48 Rowley Regis, Stafford, Coal Miner
Hannah BATTY 52 Wednesbury, Stafford,
Mary Ann BATTY 21 Rowley Regis, Stafford, General Serv
Thomas BATTY 18 Rowley Regis, Stafford, Gas Pipe Screwer
Samuel BATTY 16 Rowley Regis, Stafford, Striker For Blacksmith
James BATTY 14 Rowley Regis, Stafford, Warehouse Boy
George H. BATTY 10 Rowley Regis, Stafford, Scholar



anyone find janes and hannah in 1861 and 71 census please
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Re: Parkes family Rowley Regis problem

Post by peterd »

poss hannah

HANNAH PARKES
Christening: 29 JUN 1828 Saint Bartholomew, Wednesbury, Stafford,


SAMUEL PARKES
HANNAH


anyone find these on 41,51,and 61 census please
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Re: Parkes family Rowley Regis problem

Post by apowell »

Hi everyone,

Some interesting ideas put forward and many thanks for all your input.

I've found James and Hannah Batty on the 1861 and the 1871 census:

1861 census
Slack Hillock, Rowley Regis
James Batty 1834 Dudley (Head)
Hannah Batty 1830 Wednesbury (Wife)
Ellen Batty 1853 Rowley Regis(Daughter)
Rosehannah Batty 1855 Rowley Regis (Daughter)
George Batty 1858 Rowley Regis (Son)
Thomas Whorton 1837 Dudley (Lodger)
Sarah Pidduck 1837 Kingstanding (Lodger)

1871 census
Halesowen Rd, Rowley Regis
James Batty 1834 Dudley (Head)
Hannah Batty 1830 Wednesbury (Wife)
Ellen Batty 1853 Rowley Regis (Daughter)
Mary Ann Batty 1861 Rowley Regis (Daughter)
George Batty 1858 Rowley Regis (Son)
Thomas Batty 1863 Rowley Regis (Son)
Samuel Batty 1866 Rowley Regis (Son)
James Batty 1868 Rowley Regis (Son)
Harry G Batty 1871 Rowley Regis (son)

I think I've found James mother and stepfather John and Hannah Westwood living next door to James on the 1871 census.

Rosehannah Batty is my Great Great Grandmother.

I found Hannah Parkes born 1828 on the 1841 census living in Wednesbury with Samuel Parkes born 1761 and Charlotte Parkes born 1806 (all born in County). Hannah is a servant but could this be our Hannah and who's this Samuel?

Any ideas
Adrian
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Re: Parkes family Rowley Regis problem

Post by peterd »

dont get these 1841, 1851 censuses need some more info please


1841 census
John Parkes born 1801
Pheobe Parkes born 1791
Mariah Parkes born 1826
Sml Parkes born 1826
James Batty born 1834


is this the full census above or is the 1841 below right or different family seems unlikley ?

1851 census
John Westwood born 1805 Rowley Regis (Head)
Hannah Westwood born 1811 Rowley Regis (Wife)
Richard Westwood born 1838 Rowley Regis (Son)
Thomas Westwood born 1843 Rowley Regis (Son)
James Batty born 1834 Dudley (Son of wife)


1841
Waterfall Lane, Rowley
John Parkes 40 - Nailor
Phebe Parkes 50
Elizabeth Parkes 19
Mariah Parkes 15
Saml Parkes 15
Eli Parkes 14

living in the same house
James Braley 7
Phebe Braley 5
Mary Braley 3 Mo
all b in c


1851

1851 census
John Parkes born 1801 Rowley Regis (Head)

Phebe Batty born 1791 Rowley Regis (Lodger)
Eli Batty born 1823 Rowley Regis (Son of lodger)
Phebe Batty born 1834 Rowley Regis (Lodger)
Mary Ann Batty 1841 Rowley Regis (Lodger)

Samuel Batty is married and living next door to the above




so question who was john parkes wife in 1841 phoebe ?

where was phoebe batty with her kids in 1841

and where was hannah batty in 1841



starting to put this on bcc any help would be appreciated main body and census on but needs kid from census adding cheers pete

http://bcconnections.tribalpages.com/tr ... =922010150
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FarSide
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Re: Parkes family Rowley Regis problem

Post by FarSide »

I'll add them
Ü
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Re: Parkes family Rowley Regis problem

Post by gardener »

Hi
I just started looking at this and found the follwoing so I'll note it down before it gets lost, it must fit somehow or other :-)


Marriage at St Giles, Rowley Regis

1846 13th April

Samuel Bayte 20 miner of Waterfall Lane, son of John Parkes a collier
Elizabeth Williams 21 sp nailer of Waterfall Lane d of Thomas Willaims a nailer
Witnesses Thomas Westwood Maria Bayte

Same date, not sure if they are mixed in this or not
Joseph Parkes 25 bach nailer of Bell End s of Joseph a nailer
Fanny Haden 20 sp Nailer of Mincing Lane, d of John a cooper
Witnesses John Parkes Sarah Slim
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Re: Parkes family Rowley Regis problem

Post by peterd »

gardener wrote:Hi
I just started looking at this and found the follwoing so I'll note it down before it gets lost, it must fit somehow or other :-)


Marriage at St Giles, Rowley Regis

1846 13th April

Samuel Bayte 20 miner of Waterfall Lane, son of John Parkes a collier
Elizabeth Williams 21 sp nailer of Waterfall Lane d of Thomas Willaims a nailer
Witnesses Thomas Westwood Maria Bayte

Same date, not sure if they are mixed in this or not
Joseph Parkes 25 bach nailer of Bell End s of Joseph a nailer
Fanny Haden 20 sp Nailer of Mincing Lane, d of John a cooper
Witnesses John Parkes Sarah Slim



samuel is proberly the one living next door to john parkes and pheobe batty in 1851 census if john parkes down as father on wedding cert is phoebe parkes 1841 census phoebe batty as dob same ?
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Re: Parkes family Rowley Regis problem

Post by gardener »

peterd wrote:samuel is proberly the one living next door to john parkes and pheobe batty in 1851 census if john parkes down as father on wedding cert is phoebe parkes 1841 census phoebe batty as dob same ?


Well I'm not sure. I thought perhaps Elizabeth, Mariah, Samuel and Eli were the kids of John Parkes and Phebe Batty.
Then we have that baptism for James with mother Hannah Bayty. Could Phebe and Mary be Hannah´s too or not? Terribly difficult with name changes.

1841
Waterfall Lane, Rowley
John Parkes 40 - Nailor
Phebe Parkes 50
Elizabeth Parkes 19
Mariah Parkes 15
Saml Parkes 15
Eli Parkes 14

living in the same house
James Braley 7
Phebe Braley 5
Mary Braley 3 Mo
all b in c

1851 census
John Parkes born 1801 Rowley Regis (Head)

Phebe Batty born 1791 Rowley Regis (Lodger)
Eli Batty born 1823 Rowley Regis (Son of lodger)
Phebe Batty born 1834 Rowley Regis (Lodger)
Mary Ann Batty 1841 Rowley Regis (Lodger)

Samuel Batty is married to Elizabeth and living next door to the above


Extracted
JAMES BAYTY
Christening: 01 JUN 1834 Saint Thomas, Dudley
Parents:
Mother: HANNAH BAYTY

HANNAH BAITY
JOHN WESTWOOD
Marriage: 05 JUL 1835 Saint Thomas, Dudley, Worcester,
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Re: Parkes family Rowley Regis problem

Post by gardener »

1861 has
Waterfall Lane
John Parkes head 69
Phebe Batey boarder u 83
Eli Batey head wid 33
Sarah Hill u? 33
Thos Batey son 9
Eli Batey son 7
Phoebe Batey dau 5
Ann Maria Batey dau 4m
Jane Hill daughter 5

think he may have married
Eliza Johnson 21 Apr 1851 St Thomas Dudley
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apowell
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Re: Parkes family Rowley Regis problem

Post by apowell »

Hi everyone,

Many thanks for your input and I'm finding it a real stinker to work out.

Pete asked:

so question who was john parkes wife in 1841 phoebe ?

On the 1841 census
Waterfall Lane, Rowley Regis
John Parkes 1801 (in County)
Phoebe Parkes 1791(in County)
Elizabeth Parkes 1822 (in County)
Mariah Parkes 1826 (in County)
Samuel Parkes 1826 (in County)
Eli Parkes 1827 (in County)
James Baly 1834 (I think should read Batty) (in County)
Phebe Baly 1836 (I think should read Batty) (in County)
Mary Baly 1841 (I think should read Batty) (in County)

where was phoebe batty with her kids in 1841

Phoebe and the children are living with John Parkes under the surname Parkes? (see above). However some of the children have the surname Baly should read Batty. If you check on the 1851 census Phoebe and the children for some reason appear with the surname Battey? but still living with John Parkes at Waterfall Lane? Interestingly it gives both John Parkes and Phobe Battey condition unmarried?

where was hannah batty in 1841

Hannah appears on the 1841 census married to John Westwood with children.

I think Phoebe and Hannah may have been sisters?

It could be James Batty was born out of wedlock.

I've no idea to be honest and it looks near impossible to find any concrete information. I could order the marriage certificate of James Batty and Hannah Parkes but my hunch is it won't list the father.

The Parkes family must be mixed up with the Batty family somehow?

Regards
Adrian
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FarSide
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Re: Parkes family Rowley Regis problem

Post by FarSide »

and where was hannah batty in 1841


These Westwood's have to be related...

1841
Old Hill, Rowley
John Westwood 35 - Nailor
Hannah Westwood 30 - Brickmaker
Richard Westwood 3
Olive Westwood 10 Mo
all b in c

next door up
Benjamin Westwood 40 - Nailor
Sarah Westwood 35 - Brickmaker
William Westwood 18

next door on the other side of John and Hannah
Joseph Westwood 70 - Carter
Ann Westwood 70
Jane Westwood 9

next door
Isaac Westwood 30 - Nailor
Mary Westwood 25
James Westwood 6
Thomas Westwood 3
Ann Westwood 1
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FarSide
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Re: Parkes family Rowley Regis problem

Post by FarSide »

Marriage at St Giles, Rowley Regis

1846 13th April

Samuel Bayte 20 miner of Waterfall Lane, son of John Parkes a collier
Elizabeth Williams 21 sp nailer of Waterfall Lane d of Thomas Willaims a nailer
Witnesses Thomas Westwood Maria Bayte


Surely this post by Gardener proves the connection between the Batty's and Parkes, Samuel and Maria were sibs on the 41. I'll add them to BCC with notes..etc.. it's possible Phebe and John never married, I would have thought very unconventional for that era..
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FarSide
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Re: Parkes family Rowley Regis problem

Post by FarSide »

Have added John Parkes and Phebe Batty here

http://bcconnections.tribalpages.com/tr ... =791506591

added the kids as Batty/Parkes, let me know if it needs changing, wasn't sure how to handle the switch between Parkes and Batty.
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