ARC TBC - Shiner and Shaw

[LisaGR]

Hello all,

I'm new here, with a puzzle, and hoping I could get some pointers from you all

I'm not really really new to family history, but it's been a while so I'm a bit rusty. Here's what I've come up against (I hope it's clear enough, I'm not known for my clarity).

The information I was given about a lady (A - sorry, I'm a bit more careful about what details I give out online these days, but perhaps I'm being too uptight?) was that she was born in 1914 in or around Aberdeen. She then married in 1936/7 in England, probably around Bournemouth/Poole area. Her husband, R, I have 'fairly' solid information about - birth, death, 1911 census, children, etc. However, I haven't been able to find A's birth around Aberdeen around that time (spanning from about 1900 - 1920), though there are other people born in that window with A's surname in other parts of Scotland.

(Another complicating factor is that I've got a couple of different alternative sets of first and middle names for A. Yeahhh! )

Neither could I find any trace of a marriage between A and R around 1937. What I have found is that R married S in 1929. S seems to have been born in 1904, not in Scotland, but in the same county as R. I can't find any death record for S, either under her maiden name or R's surname.

Sooooo I think I have two possibilities. Either A and S are the same person - in which case I suspect S took on a new name, history and so on (A's birthdate would make her 14 or 15 in 1929, which is when R and S married - but maybe with a bit of fibbing and a lenient registrar/vicar that was doable?). My question then becomes, like, WHY

Or A and S are two different people. I can't find any other marriage record for R, and from his info he didn't seem the kind of guy to fib about his name (though what people get up to in their youth, ahem ahem, you never know), so he and A would have been common-law, I suppose? I can't find S' death though, as I said; she could have remarried and have died under a different surname altogether.

Did R and S divorce? R wasn't from a wealthy family, so I'm not sure if he'd have been able to pay for it. Did they go their own ways and did R, ahem, meet up with A later?

That's the situation with some of my questions mixed in. Here's the information I either have, or am ordering:

1. R's entry in the 1911 census - on comp
2. S' entry in the 1911 census - on comp
3. R's birth certificate (ordered)
4. R and S' marriage certificate (ordered)
5. The birth certificate of a child of R and A (copy being sent)
6. R's death certificate
7. A's death certificate

Do you folks have any tips for me?

[peterd]

will move this to brick wall as will get more attention

could do with you posting the census & info that you have it may help ? (both parties are deceased )

[LisaGR]

Thank you Peter, I wasn't sure which forum would be the best suited.

Forgive me being a bit dense: what kind of info from the census would be helpful? Places, parents and so on?

[peterd]

no problem

yes to all census place dates, etc the more detail info you put on the easier it will be to help

[LisaGR]

All right, here goes!

R is Leonard Ruffle, b 1902
1911 Census:
Living at home in Hartney Wintney, Hants

S is Doris Shiner, b 1907
1911 Census:
Living at home in Bournemouth

A is Elizabeth (or Gertrude) Shaw, b 1914

Marriage between R and S in Bournemouth in the 4th quarter of 1929.

[peterd]

two poss kid one marriage or two different ?

Births Sep 1938
Ruffle Rodney G Shaw Honiton 5b 11


Births Jun 1948
Ruffle Lionel R Shaw Bournemouth 6b 342

[LisaGR]

Both of those are children of R and (assumed) A (sorry, I didn't realise I should have provided that info - we're getting into talking about people who are still alive). There's another son, Norman J, b. 1940. All children of R and A.

[peterd]

i understand about taking about people still alive but the info above is in public domain and isnt personal as such if you wish anything delete then inform the poster

so cornwall area 1938

[LisaGR]

Fair points

Would the best step for now be to wait for the certificates to arrive and then work from those?

[peterd]

cert will help but hopefully some one can find the ruffle / shaw marriage ?

[LisaGR]

If anyone can find it I'd be grateful!

The BMD gives two, one in Essex between Constance Ruffle and Charles Shaw in 1935, and another in London between Florence Ruffell and Frederick Shaw in 1913 (bit early). My Leonard's middle initial is F, but not Frederick.

If A was Scottish then it's possible of course that there's a marriage up there to be found. Now why didn't I think of that earlier...

Edit: Well boo, the only one that turned up was between Colin Revell (no matches for the exact spelling of Ruffle) and Anne Shaw...in 1980

I think by the time the certs get here I may have chewed all my pencils down.

[peterd]

you tried genes reunited lisa this is on ?

Leonard Ruffle 1902 Crookham, Hampshire

contact June

and one for surrey

Leonard Ruffle 1903 Farnham Surrey

contact Stephen

[BC Wench]

Is this still a Brickwall, or have you solved it?

Unless otherwise advised this will be moved to the Brickwalls Archived section
within 24 hours

[LisaGR]

Well, it's not really been solved, but I'm at something of a loss as to how to proceed further.

[BC Wench]

Hello LisaGR, I've sent you a pm