Genealogy Forum UK

I would really appreciate any help with the following please.....

My 3x great grandfather,John Holden ( sometimes spelled Olden) was born,according to all the censuses I have,about 1817-1820 in France. He appears on the censuses as 'British Subject - born France' All I know of his father is that he too was John and was a miner,and this I have gleaned from John junior's marriage certificate when he married Letitia Cartwright in 1841 in Dudley (St Thomas Church)

I am hoping to discover why John would be born in France? I think this era was the end of the Napoleonic Wars...maybe John Senior was a soldier....but would the mother be in France too.....unless she was a French girl...?

how would I trace a birth in France? As yet,I have not found a baptism.....I assume this would have been conducted back in England.

John and Letitia lived most of their married lives in Netherton and Brierley Hill.John was a coal miner.

Many thanks

Is this him ?


Name: John Holden
Event Type: Census
Event Date: 1891
Gender: Male
Age: 71
Relationship to Head of Household: Boarder
Birthplace: France
Schedule Type: Household
Registration District: Stourbridge
Sub-District: Kingswinford


poss counsulate record might show something ?

26 Oct 1841 St Thomas Dudley
John OLDEN O B Miner Springs Mire Dudley Father John Olden Miner
Letty CARTWRIGHT O S Springs Mire Father Benjamin Cartwright Labourer
After Banns The X Of Both
Wit; John Cartwright X / Harriet Hoselam X

is this the Cartwrights in BCC ? http://bcconnections.tribalpages.com/fa ... ght-Family

1841
Delph, Kingswinford, Stourbridge, Staffordshire, England

John Jones Male 25 1816 Staffordshire
Mary Jones Female 25 1816 Staffordshire
Thomas Jones Male 4 1837 Staffordshire
Letitia Cartwright Female 20 Pit Worker 1821 Staffordshire

Hello,

Yes...this is the right family and yes,it is John on the 1891 census.....he was widowed by then. Strangely,I can't find him or Letitia on the 1881 though.....

I would really like to find out why he was born in France....or even just a baptism...or some siblings....


Thanks for looking for me

Really Need him on 1841 census ?? pos siblings etc

1861 - Level Street, Brierley Hill (reference RG9 2072 folio 141 page 23)
John Holden, Head, Married, 44, Labourer in Coal Mine, born France (British Subject)
Leticia Holden, Wife, Married, 48, born Brierley Hill
Sarah Holden, Daughter, Unmarried, 17, Scholar, born Brierley Hill
John Holden, Son, 15, Scholar, born Brierley Hill
Phoebe Holden, Daughter, 10, Scholar, born Netherton
Samuel Holden, Son, 7, Scholar, born Kingswinford
Mary Holden, Daughter, 4, Scholar, born Brierley Hill
Emma Holden, Daughter, 2, Scholar, born Brierley Hill


1871 - 28, Cottage Street Kingswinford (reference RG10 3028 folio 113 page 6)
John Holden, Head, Married, 54, Miner, born Kingswinford
Rettish Holden, Wife, Married, 55, born Kingswinford
Phoebe Holden, Daughter, Unmarried, 19, Brickyard, born Kingswinford
Mary A. Holden, Daughter, 14, Brickyard, born Kingswinford
Hannah Holden, Daughter, 13, Brickyard, born Kingswinford
Amelia Holden, Daughter, 4, Scholar born Kingswinford

I couldn't find them in 1851 or 1881 although I did find a John and Lettice Holden living in Kingston upon Thames in 1881 but both were born in Sussex so unlikely to be the same couple.

I found the 1851

John Olden 27 miner Staffordshire, Lye
Lit Olden 27
Emmanuel Olden 7
Sarah Ann Olden 5
John Olden 3
Thomas Olden 1

Source Citation: Class: HO107; Piece: 2033; Folio: 411; Page: 52; GSU roll: 87440.

Isthis the same one?

Re: Stourbridge, Brierley Hill and environs

Unread postby Neville Bastable » Tue Jun 16, 2009 9:53 am
I cannot leave the Delph without mentioning the "Nine Locks Miracle" when in 1869 the Nine Locks coal mine flooded and trapped 13 miners. There were of course a number of mining disasters and boiler explosions in earlier days but this is the one that is so amazing because apart from one man they were all brought to the surface but only when after 5 days of trying, a rescue party had finally reached the miners.
Apparently all this time they had survived in an air pocket. The man who didn't survive had apparently left the spot in an attempt to find a way out. The miners saved were listed as:-
John Handley,Thomas Hickman, Benjamin Higgs, John Holden, Thomas Hunt, Stephen Page, Zachariah Pearson, Joseph Pearson, James Sankey, Joseph Skidmore, Timothy Taylor and Thomas Timmins.
Any descendants of these brave men amongst our members ?

Wrong one this one was age 30 in the first report in newspaper Birmingham Daily Post 18 March 1869

Added some of this to Bcc
http://bcconnections.tribalpages.com/tr ... =935071309

Do you want me to move this to Brickwalls poster?

Moved to Brickwalls

perhaps someone will be able to help re the France bit if they see it

Is this still a Brickwall, or have you solved it?

Unless otherwise advised this will be moved to the Brickwalls Archived section
within 24 hours