Genealogy Forum UK

Hello All,
I have just discovered the Black Country Connections Site; rather belatedly it would appear. I was then directed to this Forum. I was more than pleased to have found details of the above ancestor - a great uncle, the brother of my maternal grandmother SARAH (nee Knowles) GAUDEN.
I am not sure how the BCC SITE worked or where all the information came from so I don't know if anyone can help me with a query regarding Aaron's parents. Ideally a family member will have the details.

The information I have is that his parents were Mary Ann (nee Leedham) and Thomas KNOWLES. They were married December Q.1870 in Stourbridge District.

The details on the BCC site show his father as being THOMAS WATSON. I know there were a lot of children - 9 I think- but they all had the surname KNOWLES.
1. Was Aaron born out of wedlock?
2. Was there a second marriage?
or some other explanation?

Although this throws up a query there is an upside to it as it goes some way to explain another query.
SARAH'S second Christian name was WATTESON, sometimes spelt WATTERSON. When I asked her about this she always said she had no idea where it came from; I did wonder if it had been a family surname - which looks like it was.

If anyone can help me with this I would be most grateful as I have not come across anyone else researching this family.
Some of them went to South Wales where there is still a connection.
LIZZIE GAUDEN

Hi Lizzie, welcome to the forum
I take it this is the family here on BCC...

http://bcconnections.tribalpages.com/fa ... son-Family

Hi Lizzie

Do you have the Birth certif for Thomas Knowles / Watson (or similar ie WAtterson etc)

this would then show if that birth here...

Births Mar 1846
Watteson Thomas Stourbridge 18 498
is him

it looks to me like He is regis in mothers name and of course it varies depending
who is writing it down and how they heard it.

He is Thomas Watson on census
born around 1846
parents marry 1848

so looks like he and prob sister Elizabeth are Watson ( or variant)
I have added Elizabeth as Knowles for now until proven.

Thomas marries as Knowles .

We put the ancestor on Bcc as how they are registered.

It looks like Aaron is born as a Watson too
WATTESON Aaron K Stourbridge (STO) Dudley Register Office STO/069/479
1877


Births Jun 1877
Watteson Aaron Knowles Stourbridge 6c 204



so I will change that on Bcc

can we post how the others are all registered pls

what do you have Lizzie re marriages for any of these pls

Hi Lizzie,
I hope you enjoy the forum and our company

Bcc is a combined effort of lots of people researching names from the Black Country . We go through some things on here to help sort out what is added.

Both Elizabeth and Thomas were born before marriage ... unless theres a christening or birth record we dont know Richard is the father...
There is a registration for an Elizabeth Knowles around the same year but there is alsoFreebmd

Elizabeth Wattison
Date of Registration: Apr-May-Jun 1842
Registration district: Stourbridge
Volume: 18
Page: 501


A witness to the marriage is Mary Waterson, relation to Sarah?
??
1841. Baldwins Green, Old Swinford
Ann Watison, 40, Nailer
Caroline, 15, Nailer
Mary, 15, Nailer
Maria, 9, Nailer
Charles, 6, Nailer
All born in County

changed Elizabeth
poss on wmbsgh
1842
Surname Forename(s) Sub-District Registers At Reference
WATTISON Elizabeth Stourbridge (STO) Dudley Register Office STO/007/312

Is this Sarah?

no Watterson in middle name
do you have the actual birth certif info pls Lizzie
to see how she is regis


Births Dec 1884
Knowles Sarah Stourbridge 6c 175

can anyone find the other kids registrations pls

1871. Beefeater ?, Lye
Job Ludham, head, 62, Shoe Maker, Clent
Mary, wife, 65,
Thomas Watson, son in law, 24, ? nut maker
Mary Ann Watson, daur, 24, nail maker
Ann Maria Shaw, grand daur, 12, Quarry Bank
John Thomas Leedham, grand son, 4
All others born Lye

Looks like John Thomas Birth as Leedham, he is on BCC as Knowles. Most seem to be registered as Watteson or variation...other than possibly Sarah I couldnt see them as Knowles

Births Jun 1872 Leedham John Thomas Stourbridge 6c 186

??(index image looks like it too)
Births Sep 1871 WARRSON Elizabeth Stourbridge 6c 166

Births Dec 1873 WATTISON Richard Wattison K Stourbridge 6c 181

??
Births Dec 1877 WATSON Mary Stourbridge 6c 160

Aarons birth is noted

Births Dec 1879 Watteson Benjamin Stourbridge 6c 180

??
Births Dec 1884 Knowles Sarah Stourbridge 6c 175


Births Mar 1882 Watteson Henry Stourbridge 6c 165


Births Sep 1887 WATTESON Job Stourbridge 6c 156

so this One for John THomas is it 1872? as they married in 1870 so he should be regis as Watterson (variant) or Knowles
Births Jun 1872 Leedham John Thomas Stourbridge 6c 186

Thank you all so much for your replies and the information. There is so much to digest that it will take me a while to go through it all. In the meantime:-

Mallosa. Thank you for your welcoming words. Yes, that is the family.

Northern Lass. No I don't have a birth certificate for Thomas Knowles/Watson. I am a novice at Family History - what does 'Regis in mother's name mean'? I don't have details of Aaron's birth and I wouldn't want you to change anything on the BCC without definite proof.

Grangers14. Thank you for your reply and kind words.

I am checking through the information I have and hope to reply in a few days as we have to go up North to a funeral tomorrow. The following is the reliable(?) information I have.

A copy (dated 16th May 1952) of The Birth Certificate for SARAH. 26th August 1884 at Beef Eaters, Lye.
Father - Thomas Watteson Knowles Nailmaker
Mother - Mary Ann Knowles formerly Leedham. X The mark of Mary Ann Knowles Mother Beef Eaters Lye
Registered. Second October 1884
Registrar. James Barratt
This copy would have been obtained at the time of Sarah's husband's death on 13th May 1952

The original Marriage Certificate of Sarah and Thomas Gauden.
The Parish Church in the Parish of St.Marks, Stambermill in the County of Worcester.
21st February 1909
Thomas Gauden 27 Bachelor Miner Chapel Street Daniel Gauden (father) miner
Sarah WARRESON Knowles 24 Spinster Union Street Thomas Knowles (father) nailmaker
Witnesses:- William Forrest
Annie Forrest
I think the WARRESON was the vicar's error.

Thank you all once again and I will endeavour to answer the remaining queries as soon as I can.

Kind regards
LIZZIE GAUDEN

Thanks Lizzie I think JO is going to sort this and add to Bcc
so that birth info will be very useful and the marriage and we can add that

Hi Lizzie,

A copy (dated 16th May 1952) of The Birth Certificate for SARAH. 26th August 1884 at Beef Eaters, Lye.
Father - Thomas Watteson Knowles Nailmaker
Mother - Mary Ann Knowles formerly Leedham. X The mark of Mary Ann Knowles Mother Beef Eaters Lye
Registered. Second October 1884
Registrar. James Barratt
This copy would have been obtained at the time of Sarah's husband's death on 13th May 1952

What does it actually say as her name please?
Sarah ?

I have changed John Thomas to Leedham and added notes.
I have left the childrens names as Knowles and added notes to possible birth registrations.
Added marriage for Sarah and just wating on confirmation of Sarahs birth to add.
here
http://bcconnections.tribalpages.com/tr ... =473180579

Thank you Northern Lass and grangers14 for your further replies. It is nearly midnight but I thought I would check the site and was surprised to find more replies. Firstly, I apologise for my ignorance regarding the 'Regis in mother's name'. I am not used to this shorthand in writing (only Pitman's).

The Birth Certificate shows only SARAH as her name.

Where do you find all the information regarding registrations?

Most of the information I have regarding Sarah's siblings is limited to names. I have a reasonably good memory and I can recall her talking about Aaron (an unusual name which stuck in my memory) she pronounced this AIRON but I believe it is now pronounced ARRON; jOB, JOHN THOMAS, RICHARD (known as Dick) BEN, - I never met any of these but MARY AND HENRY I did meet. Henry married Harriet ... When looking through census forms I knew I had the right family because of the names. I have no paperwork relating to these.

From the 1911 Census I discovered that the parents Thomas and Mary Ann (both aged 66) were at 2 Alexandra Road, Bedwellty, Monmouthshire with Benjamin (aged31 and single) Mine repairer
and Job (aged 23 and single) Mine repairer

Aaron (aged 32 and single) Mine Hewer was boarding at GLEN HILL VILLA, WOODFIELD TERRACE, PENRHIWECIBER, GLAMORGAN.

Richard Knowles 38 and married - Galvanized Iron Worker - was living at 62 SPRING STREET LYE with his wife
Sarah F. Knowles 41 Housewife
Beatrice Knowles 8 schoolgirl
David Jordan Knowles 14 ADOPTED Labourer (born Wordsley, Staffs.)
William Jordan 24 BOARDER Single

I'm not sure if this is useful but it is all I know.

My grandmother also told me that the family ran a fish and chip shop at some time. This was confirmed to me by a relative who still lives in Lye. Is there any way of ascertaining if this is true or not?

Regards
LIZZIE

May be I hadnt explained myself enough Lizzie. I wanted to know how her surname was spelt on the birth certificate.
Jo

I cant see for looking! Just noticed you have her fathers name as Thomas Watteson Knowles!
Sorry.
Jo

http://www.freebmd.org.uk/ Good place to search for BMDs Best RF