Genealogy Forum UK

linell wrote:Burial for Elizabeth Tay from The Hill aged 59 at Halesowen 10.2.1817.

Burial for Wm Tay Halesowen 10.2.1805

Can't find anything to connect Wm 1790 and John 1800

Linell.

Why do we think John was born in 1800? We know that a John Tay was baptised in 1795, and a William Tay baptised in 1790.

John who Married Rosannah was 40 in 1841:-

1841. Long Lane, Halesowen.
John Toy 40. Nailer.
Rosah Toy 40.
Elizabeth Toy 17.
Mary Ann Toy 9.
Hannah Toy 7.
Matilda Toy 5.
Edwin Toy 4.
William Toy 2.
All b. i. c

The one who was baptised in 1795 I think died in 1797, there must have been two of them, don't know who the father of the one above was

HTH Linell.

linell wrote:John who Married Rosannah was 40 in 1841:-

1841. Long Lane, Halesowen.
John Toy 40. Nailer.
Rosah Toy 40.
Elizabeth Toy 17.
Mary Ann Toy 9.
Hannah Toy 7.
Matilda Toy 5.
Edwin Toy 4.
William Toy 2.
All b. i. c

The one who was baptised in 1795 I think died in 1797, there must have been two of them, don't know who the father of the one above was

HTH Linell.

But it's not certain, it may have been possible that the one who died in 1797 was an older man.

Also didn't they used to round up the ages in the 1841 census?

On Bcc that 1800 is an estimated dob as we dont know age of JOhn it may or may not
be that John bro of Wm b est 1788

you really need death certif for John
and you need a birth certif for one of John and Rosannahs kids to see mothers name
then maybe we can find a marriage

the marriage may then have more clues to who John links to
just cos that bapt fits poss John doesnt mean it is him.

I would love to connect up John and Wm but cant without more proof

looks like Johns son Wm is regis as tay on birth .....but then Toy/Tay sounds similar depends who is writing it down

I'm confused why do we need to see a birth certificate for John and Rosanna's kids? Don't we know that the mother is Rosanna? Also could she have been called Ann?

I understand that it's quite sketchy at the moment, but that's good. It gives me something to investigate.

Can we though agree that William Tay and John Tay were brothers as they were baptised with the same parents 5 years apart? I am also 90% certain that Tay is Toy as it's been a common mistake looking at the census from 1841 and has been rectified by many Ancestry members for other strands of the family.

A birth certificate would give Rosannah's mothers name Which would help find their Marriage. Rosannah's age mirrors Johns' both 40 in 1841 and Rosannah is 50 in 1851 so as NL said, both born about 1800.

HTH Linell.

Nick a death certif for John would give his age at death of course this is only as good
as the persons knowledge of his actual dob that gives the death info to registrar.
But it may help firm up his dob and then the bapt may look better.

Personally I won't connect them up without more proof, up to you what you do on your own tree

As Linell says the maiden name will be on birth of one of kids and may help towards finding Johns marriage

Ok,

A search on Ancestry for John Toy on the 1841 Census in Halesowen brings up two results.

John Toy b abt 1801
Rosah Toy 40
Elizabeth Toy 17
Mary Ann Toy 9
Hannah Toy 7
Matilda Toy 5
Edwin Toy 4
William Toy 2

Living on Long Lane

John Foy(Toy) b abt 1801
William Foy 20
Thomas Foy 15
John Foy 15
George Foy 11
Joseph Foy 9
Samuel Foy 7
Sarah Foy 5

Living on ? Can't quite make it out. http://search.ancestry.co.uk/iexec?htx= ... id=9544163

a further check on this John in the 1851 census gives me the following:

John Toy b abt 1798
Jane Toy 35 (young wife?, not present on previous census)
Joseph Toy 18
Samuel Toy 16
Sarah Toy 14
Enoch Toy 1
Sarah Ann Roberts 6 (from Jane's marriage?)
Mary Baker 15 (?)

I mention that last listing because I think it proves that the John Foy of 1841 census is John Toy.

Ok, I'll try and see if I can find any marriages and birth certificates if possible, although they never started till 1837.

1841 census looks like Meeting Street to me.

??


West Midlands Birth indexes for the years: 1839

TAY William Halesowen Dudley Register Office HAL/001/496

Jo

Well no luck so far with my online resources.

Can't find a marriage between John Toy and Rosannah.

What I do know about them is that Rosannah lived till 1875, but John was not to be seen past the 1841 census, although I have a death record for 1838 it can't be him as he appears on the 1841 census. Plus on the 1851 census (minus John) the family has a new member called John who is 9 in 1851. Could that have been named for his late father? Possibly.

Also discovered in 1871 census Rosannah is named Rose Hannah.

I can't find birth records for William Toy b abt 1839 nor John b abt 1842, as I know that would help me discover Rosannah's maiden name and a possible marriage record with John.

Other than that though I'm perplexed.

grangers14 wrote:1841 census looks like Meeting Street to me.

??


West Midlands Birth indexes for the years: 1839

TAY William Halesowen Dudley Register Office HAL/001/496

Jo

Meeting Street? hmm, ok thanks. That is from the other John Toy that I am researching. phew.

Ok, so you have a William Tay in 1839, surely that is Toy though? It usually is. Could there be a transcript error? Mind you there is no mothers maiden name on the record.

I think you need not to worry about the Tay/Toy often misspelt mis trans

that William b 1839 looks a possible

and do we have a marriage for that other John and Jane Roberts? that would be useful to look up if we can

??

West Midlands Marriage indexes for the years: 1841

TOY John LESTER Jane West Bromwich, All Saints Sandwell Register Office 22/2/85

Northern Lass wrote:I think you need not to worry about the Tay/Toy often misspelt mis trans

that William b 1839 looks a possible

and do we have a marriage for that other John and Jane Roberts? that would be useful to look up if we can

William b 1839 as possible for what? I'm lost there.

The 1851 Census is Church Street Oldbury

John Toy b abt 1798 born Dudley
Jane Toy 35 (young wife?, not present on previous census)born Ravensitich (Ambelcote)
Joseph Toy 18 Oldbury
Samuel Toy 16 Oldbury
Sarah Toy 14 Oldbury
Enoch Toy 1 Oldbury
Sarah Ann Roberts 6 (from Jane's marriage?) Granddaughter born Oldbury
Mary Baker 15 (?) Lodger born Wordsley Stourbridge

Linell.