Help with transcribing an Occupation Please.

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Help with transcribing an Occupation Please.

Postby AndrewA » Tue Apr 30, 2013 12:03 pm

I am looking at an occupation here and I keep on seeing different words, its not the clearest of writing, but what I think it is, well it seems a little odd, but then if the enumerator had no idea, then I suppose words could be swapped around. However, I will not tell you what I think it is, as that will sublimally effect your judgement and what you see.

THe occupation in question can be found for a George Toibe in Sussex, Subdeanery, book 12, District 11, Folio 45, Page 12, Row 25(bottom of page). Here is an image of the occuption in question, please note, I am using this image with permission and its not taken from any of the subscription services.

occuptaion-marinehorse.jpg
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Re: Help with transcribing an Occupation Please.

Postby mallosa » Tue Apr 30, 2013 1:04 pm

Looks to me like ? in Marine Works :?
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Re: Help with transcribing an Occupation Please.

Postby AndrewA » Tue Apr 30, 2013 1:59 pm

This is one of the most challenging transcriptions I have had to date, 2 days i have kept going back to this and nothings clicked, normally I can work it out then its like a mist lifted and eureka moment when it leaps off the page and I say to myself "of course it is!", but with this nothing, I keep seeing different things, comparing handwriting isnt much help either.

Ok so I noticed the title of file is showing, I am certain one of the words is Marine, or Marina, but most likely Marine. there is also the word "in" preceeding it. Could be first word is dealer, now a Horse Marine is term used for people employed on barges to take the place of horses, esepcailly on routes where horses can not go, such as long tunnels, but Marine Horse? Dealer in Marine Horse? That is assuming we are looking at an H, with the middle bar not showing,

However what if its a J, it dosnt look too far off the other J, in which case we have Journeyman, that leaves the remainder, yes it could be a W and M, workman?

Another candidate is an I, or even an S,

around the coast, there were a number of people who were marine shop keepers, anything from a scrap dealer specialising in used junk or people owning decent shops selling quality goods.

So, I am none the wise and everytime I look at this I see something different, the brain likes to tell you what it thinks it should be and fills in the gaps so to speak.

Jsut as raednig tihs Snnetcane Jmbueld up dnmetorsteas
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Re: Help with transcribing an Occupation Please.

Postby Marchesgirl » Tue Apr 30, 2013 2:06 pm

Can't help much, I'm afraid - even after looking at it on 2 different subscription sites.

The best I can do is "Deal in Marine(r?) Home" although I agree the final word could be 'Horse' rather than 'Home'. Have you tried looking the individual up on later censuses to see if that gives you any clues?

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Re: Help with transcribing an Occupation Please.

Postby AndrewA » Tue Apr 30, 2013 2:47 pm

Yes I did look up other records, problem is how it is written on the census, clearly reads TOIBE, which is an old Hebrew name, many used for first names, but it has cropped up from time to time as a second name. IN 1851 there is a family who have moved to washington street, who have entered TRIBE, as a family name, the occupants match the TOIBE family. Most likely the same, but George is now listed as grocers assistant.

COuld George be Jewish? It was not uncommon for Jews to change names to English names due to anti-semetism The 1841 census has his place of birth missing, not even a F for foriegn, something to hide maybe?
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Re: Help with transcribing an Occupation Please.

Postby gardener » Tue Apr 30, 2013 4:30 pm

I think it is probably "deals in marine stores".

Perhaps you have a Romany/Traveller connection?
Last edited by gardener on Tue Apr 30, 2013 4:56 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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Re: Help with transcribing an Occupation Please.

Postby gardener » Tue Apr 30, 2013 4:51 pm

AndrewA wrote: IN 1851 there is a family who have moved to washington street, who have entered TRIBE, as a family name, the occupants match the TOIBE family. Most likely the same, but George is now listed as grocers assistant.

COuld George be Jewish? It was not uncommon for Jews to change names to English names due to anti-semetism The 1841 census has his place of birth missing, not even a F for foriegn, something to hide maybe?


I think the 1841 census probably says Tribe rather than Toibe, and there seems to be a marriage which fits George Tribe to Ann Ann Stone 3 July 1825. The 1851 family looks spot on to me.
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Re: Help with transcribing an Occupation Please.

Postby SRD » Wed May 01, 2013 7:52 am

Might it be Porter in Marine Store?

What were previous and later occupations? These may give a clue at least as to what area the person worked in.
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Re: Help with transcribing an Occupation Please.

Postby AndrewA » Wed May 01, 2013 4:05 pm

this is the 1841 census, there is no previous record of occupation, the next census he is listed as a grocers assistant.
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Re: Help with transcribing an Occupation Please.

Postby SRD » Thu May 02, 2013 7:08 am

That implies a retail background. I have ancestors who went from porter in retail businesses onto the sales floor and even into junior management, usually in the same business but sometimes changing employer. I suppose it was working from the bottom up.
In my lifetime I can recall a shop that sold animal feeds, both wholesale and retail, we'd buy a bag of peanuts for the wild bird feeder and a sack of feed for the ducks, geese & chickens. They had men in brown warehouse coats whose job it was to carry heavy goods in and out of the shop, load trailers etc. The shop staff all wore green coats and rarely did any 'heavy' work. The assistant manager (I don't recall ever seeing the manager, he worked in the office) wore shirt & tie.
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Re: Help with transcribing an Occupation Please.

Postby gardener » Thu May 02, 2013 8:24 am

I cannot see that the first word could be Porter.
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First letters: P and D on the same page
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Re: Help with transcribing an Occupation Please.

Postby sparkstopper » Thu May 02, 2013 2:01 pm

Post in Marine Stores.
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Re: Help with transcribing an Occupation Please.

Postby AndrewA » Fri May 03, 2013 1:29 pm

Not going to be a P, if anything its D for first letter of the first word.

Now how about it goes something like this.. Deal(er) in Marine I(orn)Wrs(wares)
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Re: Help with transcribing an Occupation Please.

Postby SRD » Sat May 04, 2013 7:33 am

One thing I wonder is if the word isn't marine but Marino, as in Merino wool?
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Re: Help with transcribing an Occupation Please.

Postby gardener » Sat May 04, 2013 4:40 pm

I really think that this says "Deals in Marine Stores".

The first letter is a D. It cannot be a P.
The letter after the M is not an e, it is clearly a.
The main problem is the first letter of the last word. The writer was trying to squash the , last word in, so I think the first letter is more upright that normal. I know that his letter S's are usually a bit different but there is one on the same page which is fairly similar I think.
The only other possibility that I see is that the last word is Items, but I think it is Stores because I think it looks less like an "ms" and more like a squashed "res". Could be wrong though, often am :wink: I think that the capital i is more rounded at the top :? so the pen went out left rather than down as in the S. Tricky though.

http://www.visionofbritain.org.uk/censu ... B1841OCC_M[1]&u_id=12781519&show=DB lists two marine-store-dealers in Chichester in 1841.

street.jpg
High street
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independent.jpg
Independent
independent.jpg (15.02 KiB) Viewed 2168 times
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Marine Stores
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