invalid battalion 1861

[prairie_princess]

I recieved a copy of what I believe to be my ancestors release papers from 1861 showing a 2 year extention in 1859 to the invalid battalion, ending in 1861. Bearer # 3221, registered # 290, Fort William, Calcutta, 27 April 1861. My ancestor, William brad served in India and was accompanied with his wife, Sophia. I am unsure if this is the correct document on William because of some slight discrepencies. What I would like to know:

1. Were the wives of the soilders document and how do I find that info?
2. Can you access the military records of the individual ( other than release documents)?
3. Would there be pension records because he served his full 20 years?
4. Is the "invalid battalion" for injured personel?

I found his wife, Sophia in the 1861 UK census as "head" married with her son George but no William, I believe Sophia returned to England while William completed his millitary term. In 1871 there is a Sophia Brad listed in England that fits all information I have and is listed as a widow. She emmigrated to Canada later in 1871 and is documented as "married" The 1881 Canadian census shows her as a widow ?
1. How do I find put what happen to William....Nothing in BMD
2. Why would she be listed as married on the ships manifest?
3. During what months was the census information collected? This may help with emmigration manefest dates v/s the census dates.

Any ideas or directions would be helpfull, I obtained the release documents from the Britsh Library during a recent visit.
PS what is " in or near the town of Shursbury in the county of Salop or Salps" even with a meg. glass it's still difficult!

[peterd]

hi pp this will give you census dates

viewtopic.php?f=29&t=590

PS what is " in or near the town of Shursbury in the county of Salop or Salps"

Shursbury is shrewsbury

http://maps.google.co.uk/maps?sourceid= ... e&resnum=1

and salop is the old term for shropshire

adrian might able to help on the rest of your post ?

[Maths girl]

[quote="prairie_princess"]
I found his wife, Sophia in the 1861 UK census as "head" married with her son George but no William, I believe Sophia returned to England while William completed his millitary term. In 1871 there is a Sophia Brad listed in England that fits all information I have and is listed as a widow. She emmigrated to Canada later in 1871 and is documented as "married" The 1881 Canadian census shows her as a widow ?
1. How do I find put what happen to William....Nothing in BMD
2. Why would she be listed as married on the ships manifest?
3. During what months was the census information collected? This may help with emmigration manefest dates v/s the census dates.
quote]

One thought on change of status is that she might have felt safer on the journey as a married woman ie with a "man" as a protector rather than as a widow

[prairie_princess]

I was thinking the same thing abt feeling safer on the ship, I was also able to confirm the census date of April 1871 v/s her sailing dates of June 1871 so I feel confident that I have the right Sophia.

Any thoughts on the "Invalid Battalion" or pension document?

Thanks for your imput maths grl and Peterd it was a big help!

PP

[gardener]

"Chunar fort became the headquarters of invalid battalion of European and Indian troops serving in India, all officers and men who were unfit for field service, being sent here for light duty ." from http://mirzapur.nic.in/dviit.htm It is a bit earlier than your guy so it may have changed function but at least it started off like that.

[gardener]

Is this what you have, from the british Library?
Brad, William Art Inv IOR/L/MIL/10/317/23-25 [n.d.]

[prairie_princess]

Yes it is, it was my last day in London and the film I needed was missing and I didn't have the time to stay. One of the employees of the BL offered to send the documents in the mail.......and he did!! (he’s now on the christmas card list!) Unfortunately I don't know what happened to William and that was one of my goal while in London, at least I know more abt his military service because of the amazing staff at the BL. Hopefully with the help of the forum I can solve other parts of the mystery.

PP

[gardener]

So is that William as a baker in 1841 with Sophia and daughter Sophia? Then dau sophia and son George with Hunt grandparents in 1851? Sophia must have brought the kids back before 1851 surely?

I wonder if Findmy past has anything on William? If he died in India or on the way home he might be on there. I don't subscribe to it else I would have a look.

[apowell]

Hi,

My first thought is the dates William was serving in India would fit around the time of the Indian Mutiny of 1857-1858 and it could be possible he fought in that campaign maybe was wounded and sent to a Invalid Battalion.

I've checked http://www.fibis.org which is a website listing all sorts of documents and information on the British in India during the Raj but I couldn't find a positive match on their database (which was a pain). The only entry I found but didn't really fit was:
Presidency of Marriage BENGAL
Marriage Year 1870
Husband First Names William
Husband Surname Brad
Wife First Names Harriet E.
Wife Surname Spooner

I would recommend you check this website because it's packed full of information and if you joined maybe someone could advise you on where to check next.

The other place I thought was the national archive http://www.nationalarchives.gov.uk that holds pension and discharge papers for soldiers dating back to the 1700's. If you check the website maybe you could find some information on his pension or discharge papers. The website gives you examples of soldier's papers which is also interesting.

Regards
Adrian

[prairie_princess]

Thanks Gardener and Apowell for the input.

Gardener thats my William and Sophia. They had a daughter Sophia, possibally a son William who later died, a second daughter Matilda born/died Algra and a son George in Lahar india who later came to Canada in 1869. His mother Sophia came in 71. As for FMP I was a member and had no luck on William's service or death.

Apowell, I thought the same thing abt. the Indian Mutiny and William's transfer to the Invalid Battalion. What you found doesnt fit unless they divorced and William remarried? But Sophia is indicated in the 1871 census as widow so that doenst really fit either. I do have Williams discharge papers from the BL showing that he served at Fort William in the invalid batallion until his release in 1861 sign "Chunar 5 march 61"........then nothing.......no census records no death records for England.

I will look into the sites you mentioned and may be have some luck.
pp

[Maths girl]

What you found doesnt fit unless they divorced and William remarried? But Sophia is indicated in the 1871 census as widow so that doenst really fit either. pp

I have a couple in my tree where they appear in different households in one census and he states he is married while she states she is a widow - I have assumed that they had split acrimoniously and she didn't want anything else to do with him.

Given that it appears Sophia has changed her marital to suit her convenience when she is travelling to America she could well have done it on the census too and gone with whichever seemed to be expedient at the time.

Dare I say that William living with someone as a married couple (or indeed remarrying without a divorce) would not have been that unusual in those days either especially when the distances would have meant they would have been unlikely to have been found out.--so this could be the right William

[prairie_princess]

I guess anything’s possible but he was released in 1861 so why stay in India for another 9 years and marry in 1870? I think Sophia returned home to be with the children in 1861 expecting William to follow shortly after, that he probably died returning home to England and may be this explains why I can’t find him in the BMD. I would think as a British citizen that his death would still be documented somewhere, but where?
Any thoughts on Sophia and her roll in India or how to find deaths at sea? This might remain the one mystery I can’t solve.
PP

[peterd]

we have that fibis site in links there also this one

http://indiafamily.bl.uk/UI/Home.aspx

[prairie_princess]

Any help on finding pension docs or the regiment? Not sure how to find?
Thanks PP

[apowell]

Hi,

I've tried to find out which Regiment William may have served with prior to the Invalid Battalion but it's like looking for a needle in a haystack

The only way I know to check for any pension or discharge papers will be via the national archive centre but without his Regiment it's going to be really difficult.

From the information I've found It seemed very common for front line soldiers to be transferred to Invalid Battalions after wars and this could fit in with William's circumstances with the Indian Mutiny having just finished in 1859.

I can give you a list of all the Regiments that served during the Indian Mutiny but William's Regiment could have been one of many (if indeed he did serve during the Mutiny).

National archive

Identifying regiments
Most records before 1873 are arranged by regiment. If you want to try to trace a soldier among the wealth of surviving records, you really do need to know which regiment he served in, especially if he was (like most soldiers) not discharged to pension.

Pension Payments
If you know the county or country in which your soldier was living between 1842 and 1862 for England and Scotland, or between 1842 and 1882 for Ireland and abroad, you may be able to find the regiment fairly easily. Between these dates there are records of payment of pensions, arranged by the district pay offices, which name the regiment served in (WO 22 , and PMG 8 for payments in Hanover). For nearly 9,000 pensioners in India, Canada and South Africa between 1772 and 1899, taken from WO 120/35 , WO 120/69 and WO 120/70.

The only way of researching would be to visit the national archive and start by checking the WO 120/35 ,WO 120/69 and WO 120/70 records which may have some information. If you visit the national archive I think you can search the records for free (but check in advance) also you may have to check lots of other records so the staff there maybe able advise you on which records to check.

My advice first is to have a really good read of the nationalarchive website which will give you information on all the records that are kept there etc. There is an ordering service but you would need to be confident of what you are ordering because they'll charge you a fee.
All the best
Adrian