* Archived * - Has anyone ever...

[jac]

found the father of illig.children?
My g.g.gran Catherine Ellis had 4 children(never wed) their names were..
John Evan Ellis ( used his step-grandads name for 1st marr.-Ellis for 2nd)
Eva (never wed)
Ada (never wed - 1illig.son surname Ellis)
Kate (wed as Kate Evans)
Looks as though an Evans was the father,but will never be able to prove this.
Must admit,I've had my eye on someone!
All the above born Dudley + found in census.

Jac

[Northern Lass]

sometimes you get a bit more info on the bapts especially from a vicar who emm was not amused by some goings on!
or a marriage certif might have "reputed" to be so and so.
That is wot I have found anyway.

Is there a particular one you are chasing Jac?
can you post the details and we can have a look, date of birth etc wot ever info you got and wot u want to find?

[Jimmy]

I had this one a few years ago which took me ages to work out,

Thomas Roberts, christened 18/09/1835, Kidderminster.
Mother, Priscilla, illegitimate.

Then I found his marriage details,
Marriage, 07/02/1859, St Mary’s, Kidderminster.
Thomas Roberts Morris, age 22, Shoemaker, Father, Thomas Roberts. Shoemaker.
Louisa Gould, age 18, Father, George Gould. Weaver.

It wasn't till his marriage that he started to use his father's surname as his middle name.

But I still havn't found his father.

[jac]

The more I think about this,the more I think I'm barking up the wrong tree(no pun intended)
the only reason I thought it could be this fellow,is his name John Evans,he was single in 1851
near to Catherines age -occupation hosier(tailoring connection?) and the only one in Dudley,
living not too many streets away,but, he was married by 1861.
1851 John Evans H0107/2032 F.189 P.41.
I'm beginning to wonder if the father was nearer home(or at home) step-grandfather
(I'm presuming) Charles Mills
I can't find any baptisms for children.
Births
John Evan Ellis 1851 - 1894 (no father on cert)
Eva 1857
Kate 1860
Ada 1864.
Marriages
1 John Mills(Ellis) +Sarah Matthews St James Lower Gornal 1885
Father John Mills tailor dec.
2 John Ellis +Bridget Durkin St Aug.Dudley 1892
Father Charles Ellis tailor dec.
Marriage
Kate Veronica Evans(Ellis) + George Grainger Wilkinson St Aug.1887
Father Charles St.Clair Ellis -master tailor.
Kate married into quite a wealthy family, lord knows where the Veronica came from or
the St.Clair, but I believe this is her son (before marriage)George st.clair Ellis 1884 Dudley
who became Geo.st.c.Wilkinson by 1891 cens.RG12/2283 F.5 P.4 Tipton Staffs.
If by now, you are'nt thinking "I'll give this one a miss" would you have a look at the
following?
1841 census King St.Dudley.
Charles Mills 35 tailor no
Sarah 40 no (Caths mom Sarah Ellis-no marr.to Mills)
Katherine Ellis 15 yes

1851 Catherina Ellis Dudley H0107/ F.251 P.44
1861 Catherine Ellis ......... RG9/2054 F 107 p13
1871........ .... ........ RG10/3010 F 67 P 11
1881 ........ .... .... RG11/2875 F120 P 13
Cath's mom Sarah at Wolverhampton 1861 + 1871 with son at West Brom.

Jac

[peterd]

found the father of illig.children?

My g.g.gran Catherine Ellis had 4 children(never wed)
All born Dudley + found in census.

their names were..


John Evan Ellis 1851 - 1894 (no father on cert)
John Evan Ellis ( used his step-grandads name for 1st marr.-Ellis for 2nd)

1st marriage John Mills(Ellis) +Sarah Matthews St James Lower Gornal 1885, Father John Mills tailor dec.
2nd marriage John Ellis +Bridget Durkin St Aug.Dudley 1892, Father Charles Ellis tailor dec.

Eva 1857
Eva (never wed)

Kate 1860
Kate (wed as Kate Evans)
Kate Veronica Evans(Ellis) + George Grainger Wilkinson St Aug.1887, Father Charles St.Clair Ellis -master tailor.

Ada 1864.
Ada (never wed - 1illig.son surname Ellis)


Looks as though an Evans was the father,but will never be able to prove this.
Must admit,I've had my eye on someone!


The more I think about this,the more I think I'm barking up the wrong tree(no pun intended)
the only reason I thought it could be this fellow,is his name John Evans,he was single in 1851

(1851 John Evans H0107/2032 F.189 P.41.)

living near to Catherines age -occupation hosier(tailoring connection?) and the only one in Dudley,
living not too many streets away,but, he was married by 1861.?

I'm beginning to wonder if the father was nearer home(or at home) step-grandfather
(I'm presuming) Charles Mills I can't find any baptisms for children.?


Kate married into quite a wealthy family, lord knows where the Veronica came from or the St.Clair,

I believe this is her son before she marriage George st.clair Ellis 1884 Dudley
who became Geo.st.c.Wilkinson by 1891 cens.RG12/2283 F.5 P.4 Tipton Staffs.

If by now, you are'nt thinking "I'll give this one a miss" would you have a look at the following?

1841 census King St.Dudley.
Charles Mills 35 tailor no
Sarah 40 no (Caths mom Sarah Ellis-no marr.to Mills)
Katherine Ellis 15 yes


1851 Catherina Ellis Dudley..H0107/ F.251 P.44
1861 Catherine Ellis ......... RG9/2054 F 107 p13
1871........ .... ........ RG10/3010 F 67 P 11
1881 ........ .... .... RG11/2875 F120 P 13

Cath's mom Sarah at Wolverhampton 1861 + 1871 with son at West Brom.

Jac

jac tried to bring together your two post and broke them in to working parts hope it correct and easier to follow pete

[peterd]

1881 cenus has catherine down as widow ? suppose she could have lied ?

72 Wellington Road,Dudley, Worcester

Catherine ELLIS W 57 Dudley, Worcester, Tailoress
Eva ELLIS 23 Dudley, Worcester, Tailoress
Kate ELLIS 20 Dudley, Worcester, Tailoress
Ada ELLIS 17 Dudley, Worcester, Tailoress

[jac]

Hello Peter
Re.Catherine, I would say yes she was lying,also a widow in 1891 + 1901.Seems a
bit iffy she says this after Charles Mills death.Wonder why her moms not living with them
in 61+71. It seems this family all told a few porkies!

Jac

[peterd]

could do with seeing the census for the year your on about

[jac]

Peter
1891 census Cross St Dudley RG12/2032 f 189 p 41
Catherine Ellis head widow 60
Eva daug 24
Ada ... 23
John P g,son 11mths

1901 Stafford St Dudley RG13/2745 f 91 p 32
Catherine Ellis head widow 76
Eva 43
Percy g.son 11

Jac

[peterd]

been looking at this and cannot find a registered birth something not right here but dont know what yet can you post the othere census you have pete

[Jimmy]

Is this the one.

CATHARINE ELLIS
Christening: 14 MAR 1824. Saint Thomas, Dudley, Worcester,
Parents:
WILLM. ELLIS.
SARAH

[jac]

Jimmy
Yes that's Catherines baptism.
Peter
1841+91+01 census info in previous posts.
1851 King St Dud.
Charles Mills head mar 49 tailor Isle of Wight
Sarah wife 55 ...ess Yorkshire
Catherine Ellis daug unm 26 ....... Dudley

1861Oxford St Dud
Catherine Ellis head unm 34 tailoress Dudley
John Evan Ellis son 9
Eva ... daug 4
Kate ... ....1
Charles Mills boarder unm 60 tailor Isle of Wight

1871Himley Rd Dud
Charles Mills head wid 60 tailor Isle of Wight
Catherine Ellis daug mar 47
John E Ellis son 18 tailor ass
Eva .... daug 13
Kate 10
Ada 7

1881 Wellington Rd Dud
Catherine Ellis head wid 57 tailoress
Eva ... d 23 ......
Kate .... 20 ....
Ada .... 17 ....

See what I mean about the porkies.
Childrens births all on Freebmd (Eva-Kate +Ada=Elliss)
Jackie

[Jimmy]

Are these the one's,

Births Sep 1857.
Elliss Eva. Dudley. 6c. 93.

Births Sep 1860.
ELLISS. Kate. Dudley. 6c. 115.

Births Sep 1863.
ELLISS. Ada. Dudley. 6c. 113.

[peterd]

Are these the one's,

Births Sep 1857.
Elliss Eva. Dudley. 6c. 93.

Births Sep 1860.
ELLISS. Kate. Dudley. 6c. 115.

Births Sep 1863.
ELLISS. Ada. Dudley. 6c. 113.

so what does these birth certs have in as father jac?

[jac]

Peter
John Evan Ellis Sept qtr 1851 Dudley (my g.grandad)
When I went to buy this cert I gave what I thought was his
fathers name,the very,very helpful assistant told me I had the correct christian name for
his mother,but not for the father,I already sort of knew the set up,so I said "no fathers name"
she then nodded, that saved me £7,what was the point of buying it.
I don't feel like buying the certs for his sisters,as they might probably say the same!!

Jac