*Arch * --Thomas & Mary Nock Dudley/West Bromwich

[Jimmy]

This looks like the birth of William, Hunslet is about 10 mile from Normanton.
Births Dec 1867.
Nock William. Hunslet, 9b 2_0.

I think that should read, 9b, 280.

[Northern Lass]

Ok Nocky looked up that marriage for Thomas Nock and Mary Ann Law and have posted on Connections here.....

http://bcconnections.tribalpages.com/tr ... =583084177

not sure the witnesses are any help unless they are hubbies to any sisters he had!

It says James father is deceased...but wonder when!

[nocky1972]

Hi Jan,
really appreciate you finding this info for me - its fantastic.
Have had a quick look at the witnesses and there is a Thomas Shorthouse b: abt 1825 (same time as Thomas Nock) who has links with Coal mining... later in years owned a Coal mine according to census returns. Maybe he was a workmate or boss of Thomas Nock's ?

Will look for the other witness and look for the death time period for James Nock

kind regards

Simon

[Northern Lass]

Been thinking about this .... I think it might be a good idea to look up the bapts of the other kids bapt at St thomas with the parents James and Ann think they started at abt 1815?

Then find those kids marriages...see if they are under the civil regis period and see if James is alive on any of em.Think Thomas was one of the later kids for this couple.
Then it might pin down a date of death for James and so maybe a bapt etc...even if we cant track his marriage
and his actual dob....

[nocky1972]

Hi Jan,
I agree fully... did a bit of digging yesterday and came up with a bit of a breakthrough. Looked at 1841 census for Thomas Nock and found him and his two brothers James b:1818 and William b:1821 living with William and Ann Raven. Checked out when they were married of the IGI and got the following : -

William Raven
Ann Maria Knock
Married: 07 DEC 1834 Saint Martin, Birmingham, Warwickshire

Then found Ann Maria Nock of IGI : -
Christening: 26 MAR 1815 Saint Thomas, Dudley, Worcestershire

Parents James Nock & Ann

Looks like James, Thomas and William went to live with their sister; possibly because their mother and father died. So need to find out where Joseph, Elizabeth & Edward where at that time.

Other children of James & Ann are : -

Elizabeth : Christening: 20 FEB 1820 Saint Thomas, Dudley, Worcestershire
William : Christening: 04 NOV 1821 Saint Thomas, Dudley, Worcestershire
James: Christening: 12 JUL 1818 Saint Thomas, Dudley, Worcestershire
Edward: Christening: 19 OCT 1828 Saint Thomas, Dudley, Worcestershire

and of course the ones we have already got

Joseph: Christening: 21 MAY 1826 Saint Thomas, Dudley, Worcestershire
Thomas: Christening: 06 JUL 1823 Saint Thomas, Dudley, Worcestershire

Will add a lookup request for the children of James & Ann

Intrigueing stuff this !

Speak soon

Simon

[Northern Lass]

That is great well done nocky!

Dont forget to add it all to Connections will you!

so 3 of them are sibs....bet the others are too... yes add em to look ups I can just check on the bapts and in the meantime any marriages to these sibs would be really useful to look up... parents must be dead by 1841 ...but the sibs marriage would hopefully say that too...shame that ann maria one is before 1837.

I suppose I hoped that maybe James might be alive on a marriage in say 1837 and deceased on a bit later one then you could get a death cert and get his dob.

so if Ann Maria is say the first kid then a marriage in 1810 ish onwards...could be anywhere...did we look for marriages outside the area?

[nocky1972]

Hi Jan,
have added all but Edward onto BC Connections... Will check out more on marriages etc.

have scanned 1841 cesus for Edward Nock and have found the following :

John Nock 40 - Tailor - Stone St, Dudley
Ann Nock 30
Edward Nock 15 - Tailor
Elizabeth Nock 15
John Nock 14
Ann Nock 10
Henry Nock 8

I don't reckon that the Ann Nock 30 is my Ann Nock but its strange that the eldest of the children listed are Edward & Elizabeth and the next two eldest have their parents names. I thought that people in those day named their first born after themselves of their grandparents.. Might be reading too much into it ha ha !

Will carry on digging

Regards
Simon

[peterd]

Ok Nocky looked up that marriage for Thomas Nock and Mary Ann Law and have posted on Connections here.....

http://bcconnections.tribalpages.com/tr ... =583084177

not sure the witnesses are any help unless they are hubbies to any sisters he had!

It says James father is deceased...but wonder when!

think thomas shorthouse must be connected to the church as witness to daniel watterson 1836 marriage tipton unless they both knew him ?

http://bcconnections.tribalpages.com/tr ... =851498223

[Northern Lass]

this looks like it could be archived pending look ups so moving to archived and will bring back with bapt info etc on this family

[nocky1972]

Hi ya NL,

okey dokey !

thankyou

[Northern Lass]

Ok Nocky here you go some of the bapts look ups done.
Quite interesting I think they must be the same but sometimes James is referred to as a nailer and others quite specifically as a nail weigher.
all dudley

But because of the way the kids are living with that Ann Raven on 1841 must be same family

cant remember off top of head which ones were living with ann...maybe see if they are referred to as having father James nailer or nail weigher...

-26 March 1815 Ann Maria dau of James and Ann Nock Dudley nailer

- 12 July 1818 James son of James and Ann Nock Dudley Nail weigher

-20 Feb 1820 Elizabeth dau of James and Ann Nock dudley Nailer

-4 Nov 1821 William son of James and Ann Nock Dudley nailer

-19 Oct 1828 Edward son of James and Ann Nock Dudley nail weigher

[nocky1972]

Hi ya Jan,
many thanks for looking these up for me.
The kids that lived with Ann Maria were James, Thomas & William so it looks like its a mix of nailor and nail weigher; maybe that's what nailors' did....

Will add these dates to tribal pages unless already done

kind regards

nocky1972

[Northern Lass]

Hi ya Jan,
many thanks for looking these up for me.
The kids that lived with Ann Maria were James, Thomas & William so it looks like its a mix of nailor and nail weigher; maybe that's what nailors' did....

Will add these dates to tribal pages unless already done

kind regards

nocky1972

my pleasure nocky

still got the marriages to ascertain...

I think bapts are on but not the distinction of occup ....up to you if you add that or not
but to me I think the assumption that they are yours is correct.

I am wondering if the marriage could be ST Giles and not on the IGI.
need to see via hugh wallis if that is covered for 1815 ish
where were they living on 1841 cant remember.

[nocky1972]

Hi ya,
Ann Maria and her brothers were living at 'All Saints Street, West Brom in 1841 and 'Little Ann Street - 5 Court, St Bartholomew, Birmingham' in 1851.
As for James and Ann i ain't got a clue ?... did you mean you think St Giles records may disclose if where James and Ann may be living ?

regards
nocky1972

[dianel]

Hi Jan,
I don't reckon that the Ann Nock 30 is my Ann Nock but its strange that the eldest of the children listed are Edward & Elizabeth and the next two eldest have their parents names. I thought that people in those day named their first born after themselves of their grandparents.. Might be reading too much into it ha ha !

I don't know if other countries followed the Scottish naming traditions at all, but that was:
1st son after father's father
1st daughter after mother's mother
2nd son after mother's father
2nd daughter after father's mother
3rd son after father
3rd daughter after mother
... any more children - suit yourself.